Die Stelle in: Mark Boyle: MONEYLESS MANIFESTO u Kommentare

Bücher, Biographien usw, Lesenswertes von und über Schenker-Bewegung
oeff oeff
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Registriert: Mi 8. Jan 2014, 16:53

Die Stelle in: Mark Boyle: MONEYLESS MANIFESTO u Kommentare

#1 Beitragvon oeff oeff » Mo 5. Mai 2014, 12:51

Mir liegen mittlerweile auch die englischen Bücher von Mark Boyle vor ("The Moneyless Man. A year of freeconomic living." und "The Moneyless Manifesto.") , und ich kann aus dem zweiten Buch (welches auch online gelesen werden kann, hier die Stelle über uns: http://www.moneylessmanifesto.org/book/ ... n-and-men/ ) die Literatur-Angabe, wo ich und Schenker-Bewegung mit erwähnt werden, nun auch bzgl. der Print-Ausgabe präzise machen:
BOYLE, Mark: The Moneyless Manifesto. Live well - live rich - live free. East Meon Hampshire: Permanent Publications 2012. S. 58f (ISBN 9781856231015)
((Etwas genauere Angaben zur Publikation:
Published by
Permanent Publications
Hyden House Ltd
The Sustainability Centre
East Meon
Hampshire GU32 1HR
United Kingdom
Tel: 01730 823 311
Fax: 01730 823 322
Overseas: (international code +44 - 1730)
Email: info@permaculture.co.uk
Web: http://www.permaculture.co.uk
Printed in the UK by CPI Antony Rowe, Chippenham, Wiltshire
Some rights reserved. [license_3.0] This work is licensed under a Creative Commons Attribution-NonCommercial-NoDerivs 3.0 Unported License. For more information: http://creativecommons.org/licenses/by-nc-nd/3.0 ))

In Kapitel 3 "THE PROGRESSION OF PRINCIPLES (POP) MODEL" (S.51-60) steht im Abschnitt "MONEYLESS WOMEN AND MEN"(S.57-60) auf S. 58f:
"Jürgen Wagner: as part of the Schenkers (Givers) movement, the man known as Oeffie has been living without money since 1991. As a moneyless German, most of his work is in his native tongue. If you speak German or have access to translation, you can learn more about him and his perspectives online." [Und in der dazugehörigen Anmerkung 54: "For more information about Jurgen Wagner, go to http://www.holistic-love.net ."]

oeff oeff
Beiträge: 1524
Registriert: Mi 8. Jan 2014, 16:53

Re: Die Stelle in: Mark Boyle: MONEYLESS MANIFESTO u Komment

#2 Beitragvon oeff oeff » Mo 5. Mai 2014, 13:45

Etwas Kommentar von mir dazu:
Ich freue mich, dass es das kleine Netzwerk unter den 'international Geldlosen' mittlerweile überhaupt gibt.
Die Intensität könnte noch intensiver werden.
Verdient gemacht hat sich da besonders Elf Pavlik, der auch die Netz-Website http://www.moneyless.info aufgebaut hat...

Eigentlich hatte Mark Boyle für sein Buch über einen unter uns Geldlosen existierenden Mail-Verteiler vorher um Beiträge von uns anderen nachgefragt.
Besser gesagt, hatte er einige Zeit zuvor schon bei uns wegen Beiträgen für seinen Blog angefragt; ich zitiere aus einer Mail an uns:

Hey beautiful moneyless beings,
I hope all is fantastic in your worlds.
I write a blog on the Freeconomy (http://www.justfortheloveofit.org) website
about moneyless living and all the different philosophical and practical
aspects to it.
I am trying to steer attention on it away from me though and instead onto
moneyless living itself. I want to show that there are more and more
people choosing this path, all for slightly different reasons. People will
relate to some people and their philosophies more than others. I think
this could be a powerful series if you're all up for participating.
I would love it if all/some of you would write a guest blog for the
website - I'd post one a week in a series of guest posts by other
moneyless people. ...
Have a fantastic day, great to be sharing the planet with you,

Mark Boyle
the freeconomy community
If not you, then who? If not now, then when? Be the change you want to see
in this world...

Ich schrieb ihm als Antwort am 30.1.2011:

Why I live without money...

I am living without money, because we need a (global) responsability-orientation, which is looking for the good of the whole, instead of being dominated by isolated partial-interests and -calculations... (Every adult person should habe this responsability...)
The flow of giving and taking should try to fit for the whole, independent of, whether there is an (immediate/individual) revenge or not...
It is an attitude of IDENTIFICATION with the world, as cells are identified in an organism... --
where a cell can give in quite another direction as it gets its needed things from..., and where for example a "white blood-cell" is ready to "eat" illness-bacteria and dy with them – what could not be the result of an individual revenge- or advantage-calculation... -- The only decisive motivation is the happiness of IDENTIFCATION WITH THE WHOLE...)


And among human beings the basic-capacity of us all, that everybody can think and decide, makes the free participation in a peaceful and just society such a valuable possible contribution of the individual, that we should lovingly invite every human being to become such a "global consensus-brother or -sister"... Beginning with myself..., doing to others, what I expect of them to do to me..., non-violently making gifts...
Regarding us as becoming a big emancipated humanity-family, deciding in consensus, making gifts in love und sharing according to abilities and needs, so that everybody feels as happy as the others...
Money or any form of isolated revenge-calculation (as decisive criterium) is not fitting for such a 'GLOBAL RESPONSABILITY AND LOVE(-PLANNING)'...
It is not "organic" and it is not according to the "logics of love"... As you can directly feel in deep friendships, love-affairs (with the woman as my "heart" for example...) and loving families...

I came to this (theoretical) decision for my life, when I was 13 years old... (1977)

It was my inner awakening to an adult person or for the maturity to take control of my own "steering-wheel for life"...:
I found out, that I could make my own decisions with my "free will", on the basis of my own thinking...
I saw, that the basic-principle for (my) orientation should be: "Always look for the most important question and then for the most reasonable answer to it..."
So I came to find my essential self-understanding as a "REASON-SOUL" ("animal rationale"): Where my REASON is the longing for sense, at best a sense of the whole... - and SOUL means my connection to the bio-cosmos around me, integrating me in the big life-context and making me try to serve this unity of life as good as possible...
So it was clear to me, that I would dedicate my life for a globally responsable development in the world...
As the most important for this I recognized, that the human beings needed a "minimum-consensus for global responsability"...
As the best-possible content for this "minimum-consensus" I found: "There must be enough REASON and LOVE, so that the humans become able for a 'common-good-consensus'..."
All other questions can best then be given into these consensus-decisions of the woken up "GLOBAL CONSENSUS-BROTHERS AND -SISTERS"...

1991 I founded "Schenkers-Movement" ("Givers-Movement") and began to live these ideas in praxis, without state (identity card), money and luxury, as a 'homeless pilgrim on the street', in "Houses of Hospitality" (where we offer social work for the poorest as a gift) and in "nature projects", where in part I am living like a free animal (eating wild herbs, insects and so on)...

Let us begin to build "COMMUNITIES OF GLOBAL CONSENSUS-SHARING", whereever we can, as much as possible...

Our "Schenkers-Movement" has two associations and 6 community-projects in Germany, and everybody is invited to join... Or to build further "Schenker-Projects", whereever he or she is...
In "Schenkers-Movement" it is possible to begin with smallest steps, and to make the steps bigger freely, as one wants...


Öff Öff / Oeffie (Jürgen Wagner)


schenkeraspiegelforum.plusboard.de (with an english thread)


die-schenker.yooco.de (with Schenker-Chat from 20 o'clock)

http://wiki.gifteconomy.org/wiki/Lifest ... Economists

I am also registered in the forum of Mark Boyle..., but often I even do not find the time to look in my personal e-mail-accounts... - It's so much work, not to earn money! ;-)

Und am 14.11.2011 schrieb ich an den Verteiler bzgl. des schönen Bemühens von Elf Pavlik um unsere gemeinsame Netz-Website:

Dear moneyless friends!

I send you my comment, which I gave to Pavlik on the moneyless.info-site, also here, in case, some people can see it better here:

I am very happy about the ideas and work of elf Pavlik...
By such activities, I think, we can create together a quite open horizon (an open field of visions and practical possibilities), where everybody can see, critically examine and - if found useful - use all aspects and possibilities of living without money... ((In the last ideal, I think, it will mean: gift-economy, which organizes giving and taking according to the good energy-flow of the WHOLE, instead of isolated revenge-calculations...))
The whole spectrum: Persons (for example 'Lifestyle Gift Economists'), (gift-)exchange-networks, community-models... -- everything can be seen then, without excluding something... Organized in a way, that all searching people can orientate themselves in a best-possible way...
So that we and humanity best can grow to a LOVING FAMILY, where we simply share, as it meets the capacities and needs of the brothers and sisters and of mother earth, planning in consensus-communities in a ressource-based way -- instead of short-sighted, fragmented revenge-thinking without limits or scruples, as it is connected for example with the 'cold' money-logics... (You can add moral etc. motivations to the money-functioning 'from outside', but the ('inner') logics of the money itself is such revenge...)
Such a clear and not-exclusive overview of the moneyless-living-possibilities is one of my dreams of the last 20 years, during which I live now without state and money, only exchanging gifts...
Some people already began work in this direction in the last years (look at the 'altruists'-list of 'Lifestyle Gift Economists', or at the websites of Mark Boyle...)...
I think, elf Pavlik can contribute a very beautiful form to it... We can all cooperate for it...

Hug to all human brothers and sisters,
Oeffie (Öff Öff alias Jürgen Wagner)

Now concretely to the idea of a 'guide' for the cities (or villages), what possibilities of moneyless-living can be found there. Very good idea to my mind.
I can offer a list of the few community-project-adresses, which we have till now. If someone is ready to live very simple (by containered food, or by collected wild herbs etc.), then we can offer (as a gift) in these projects a rather complete (community-)basis of life...
The main-projects are
1. 'House of Hospitality', Alte Dorfstr. 6, 19370 Parchim OT Dargelütz (where it should be possible to be welcomed at every time), Schenker Rasputin: 038720-88558 or 01794072506;
2. 'Friedens-Garten', Haus 5c, 02627 Hochkirch OT Pommritz (in times, when one of us is in the project and thinks, he 'can stand it'; see telephone...), Uwe Haspel: 03593980602 ;
3. 'Biotopia', Alte Lausitzer Str. 2, 02708 Löbau OT Kittlitz (in times, when one of us is in the project; see telephone...), Öff Öff: 017627110248 ;
4. 'Lilitopia', 35260 Stadtallendorf (in times, when one of us is in the project; in the house only people, where the community-members think, they 'can stand them'; with Öff Öff in an old hut in the forest...), Öff Öff: 017627110248 or 01629182725;
(There are perhaps some more addresses, which I can add later, but I begin with those 4 projects...)

Ich grüße das "NATÜRLICHE GÖTTLICHE LICHT" in allen...
"das Öff!Öff!"/ Jürgen Wagner
international/englisch-sprachig: http://www.global-love.eu
deutsch-sprachig: http://www.dieschenker.wordpress.com

Am 20.12.2011 schrieb Mark dann über seine Absicht, ein zweites Buch zu schreiben und bat uns um Beiträge:

Lovely moneyless people

I'm writing another book on moneyless living (working title is The
Money-free Life but I hope that changes, any ideas welcome!), and I was
wondering if any of you guys wanted to contribute a short piece about
why you live without money. The more the merrier, so all of you are most
welcome. I want this book to be nothing to do about me, and I want to
show as many perspective as possible and show that more and more people
are doing it and why - so I'd really appreciate it!

Its aim is to reach out to a wide audience and unite people who want to
create a more loving world. There will be two parts. Part I looking at
the philosophy behind in, but in a much more radical and in-depth way
than the first book. Part II will be all practical, illustrating the
options for moneylessness under chapters such as food, transport,
shelter etc. So many people contact me wanting to start on their journey
to moneyless, and have no idea how, so I felt this was something I
needed to do before moving back onto the land as I just don't have the
time to reply to each email any more, whilst still wanting to be able to
help. Hopefully as we become more this will sort itself out anyway!


If not, no problem, I totally understand!
If yes, then I'd love if you all could send the following two little
things, on an openoffice doc if possible but if not in email is fine:

1. Your name and how you want to be introduced... ... Include any websites etc you want plugged.
2. Between 0-400 words simply about why you live without money. Bit
longer if absolutely essential, but the more concise you can make it the
better, even 2-3 lines is good. I know its not a lot, but its a great
exercise in how you would explain it to a stranger on the street if they
asked you...

The only thing else I'd suggest is to let your passion for it come
through, and keep in mind that the book will be partially wrote for
people who just need that extra bit of help and encouragement, and not a
scolding...not that any of you would anyway! :D


Ich bot Mark am 8.1.2012 den folgenden Text-Beitrag an:

Dear Mark (and others)!

Here is my text about 'why I am living without money', for your coming 'survey-book'...
I hope, it is short enough...

Why I am living without money:

I am “Öff!Öff!”(“Oeffie”) ( http://www.global-love.eu , http://www.lilitopia.de ), the founder of the "SCHENKERS-(GIVERS- or GIFT-)MOVEMENT",
which wants to offer as a '(MINIMAL) BASIC CONSENSUS FOR A GLOBALLY RESPONSABLE DEVELOPMENT': We must develop enough reason and (holistic) love (nonviolent sharing; exchange of gifts...), so that the humans sufficiently can manage '(reason-)consensus for the good of the whole'! (So that it is best then to give all other questions trustingly into their hands for such consensus-decisions, preventing any unnecessary 'ideology'...)
(- It can also be called a 'global [or holistic] identification-culture[or -civilization]', with 'holistically [world-]identified persons and societies/society'... - If the world is [already] a 'living unity' ['Gaia'] or not; with our intelligence we have become something like a 'head' of it; how much of fusion/union [like 'cells in an (super-)organism'; or - for religious people - seeing us and the world as the 'body of god'...] is needed for sufficient responsability, treating everything not as exploitable object, but for the good of it and of the world, loving everything as 'piece of the world puzzle', serving the 'whole picture' [the 'whole calculation', the 'whole life-(energy-)flow'...] instead of 'fragmented partial interests and [shortsighted] revenge calculations'?... -)
We participants of 'Schenkers-Movement' try to be pioneers for this, experimenting with methods of 'practical idealism' like 'organic thinking' (= 'to look at every moment for the most important question and the answer with best reasons'), 'soul-work with light and love', 'non-violent communication (and action)' as way to 'consensus-culture' etc...
Since 1991 our core group (the socalled 'Schenkers'['Givers']) is living without luxury, state and money, only exchanging gifts with other humans (in 'global or holistic love'), and experimenting with nature-life, independent from the 'system': “When I can eat the plants from nature, I do not need rulers or bosses!” "Free mother earth for free sharing people!"
We invite other humans to take part in "Schenkers-Movement", what cannot be too hard for anybody: If someone thinks, our idealistic dream of humans as "global consensus-brothers and -sisters" is ok (people with such “theoretical yes” we call “allies”), he or she already can take part in thinking about it in boards like schenkeraspiegelforum.plusboard.de (about 'holistic sustainability' etc.), or can take part in our non-profit ally-organisations, or can live with us in our community-projects, even maintaining his/her 'normal citizen-life' (with identity-card, money, job, shopping, TV or what else...)... -- Everybody decides for him-/herself, what practical consequences he/she likes or not...

So let's do the “holistic or integral (identification-)revolution”!
OEFFIE (alias Jürgen Wagner)
(Schenkers can be for “Free Love” etc.; everybody in “Schenkers-Movement” can have his/her own opinion about such things...; my form of "FREE TRUE LOVE" is since february 2010 a lifelong monogame relation with my wife Anke... )

Big hug for all of you,

Ich grüße das "NATÜRLICHE GÖTTLICHE LICHT" in allen...
"das Öff!Öff!"/ Jürgen Wagner
international/englisch-sprachig: http://www.global-love.eu
deutsch-sprachig: http://www.dieschenker.wordpress.com


Angesichts dessen, was Mark im Buch am Ende abgedruckt hat, war mein Beitrag ihm wahrscheinlich doch etwas zu lang... ;-)
Aber was soll's...
Dass das Buch schonmal da ist, voll mit aus meiner Sicht viel richtigen Inhalten (es gab im Mail-Austausch zwischen uns Geldlosen auch so einiges an tiefgehendem Austausch dazu, zwischen den von mir hier auszugsweise dargestellten Mails...), ist etwas seeehr Wertvolles...
Und dass es darin einen Überblick gibt über unser kleines Geldlosen-Netz...

Die Dinge werden weiter wachsen, wie es ihren inneren Wachstums-Gesetzen entspricht, denke ich...

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